Look, Disneyland has been very successful. Not only they keep raising their prices, but the park is always packed to the max. If Magic Mountain could somehow partner up with Disney and bring some disney rides and their characters and their landscapes to Magic Mountain, without raising their prices to skyrocket, that could be a solution.
Ken, you are a dork. Everyone knows that D land is for little kids and old ladies. The mountain is for getting the crap scared out of you. I’m not sure if you are on the right track but a really good hook could definitely help. I’m thinking that a monster coaster with a very lengthy ride time and features that only I can create to set records that will never be surpassed by any true coaster, ever.
I dont think that is a good idea of selling of the land to a separate management company….some of the park could be off land as management company raises prices of leasing land and the park now closes and become housing developments or whearhouseing…and the smaller parks are most not owned by 6 flags and just ate management agreements
Real estate lease backs are common practice in privately held companies. You create two companies, one holds the real estate and the other is the company itself. The “company” pays “rent” to the real estate holder, which is actually the same person or people. In this case they sell the real estate to a 3rd party to generate cash, and lease back from the new landowner. Not a bad way to raise cash as long as you get a long term lease that is unbreakable. Otherwise the new land owner can “evict” (tear down) the theme park and build condo’s or a shopping complex. Happens all the time in commercial real estate. Happy Holidays
Al: 100% agreed. This new CEO is BAD NEWS and needs to go…12 months ago!
Ron: You hit it – thr problem is Six Flags isn’t a private company and they aren’t doing it for asset and liability divestiture. Instead, as you pointed out, this would be going to some outside party (or likely many given the spread of properties) and I could see the theme parks ceasing to exist – one by one as they find people to buy the valuable rides for usage elsewhere (more capital for the “property investor”) then shut down the parks. If this happens, it will be the beginning of the end for Six Flags.
Keeping real estate under a second holding company is just good business. But that’s not what is being suggested. These “investors” are looking for a payday, and are trying to force a very bad business decision on the park. Unless Six Flags is on the verge of going out of business, this does them no long-term benefit. It takes them from landowner to renter.
I think making the park more fun for younger kids, revamping Bugs Bunny world would help attract new customers.
Keeping Roaring Rapids open through the fall would help retain locals. They only have one water ride open in the park year round, it’s super hot out here..
They’ve done away with a lot of features that made the park great. The most memorable attraction was Tidal Wave, that’s gone now. I think getting rid of log jammers was also a bad move. They replaced it with a theatre that’s never used.
More advertising would help. Magic mountain was so cool when I was a kid, and I remember seeing commercials about it.
My teen loves to go to six flags now with his friends and they spend money, we make sure they have money to spend. I resented the comment about not focusing on broke teens, teens are what keep the park going.
A new family ride is probably the best solution. If they want to attract higher income families they need a new family ride and maybe a top notch day care service, something like kids quest but with a six flags flare they can put it in the old log jammer location, near the restaurant and Bugs bunny world would be the perfect location.
Selling off assets is what killed sears. Having to be Holden to share holders will always cause businesses to fail. Doing this is going to be the first step to the end of Six flags. I’m sure these “investors”. Just want to make as much money in the short term as they can just like those who made the choices for sears. They will first sell the properties an lease them. Then the leases will go up. When six flags can’t cover them they sell seize ownership. Sell the assets (coasters) the. The land to developers. The end of the business. In the end the ones owning the land will make all the money. Don’t do it.
I’m a Disney person myself, however I do enjoy going to Six Flags. It is different. I will say this, if Six Flags gives up their real estate, it will not end well. The investors are in it for the money, and if they can make money by selling the land or building huge Resorts or communities, that’s where they are ultimately going to go. They will eat Six Flags alive. Don’t do it.
This is exactly what someone would push for if they want to dump their shareholdings. We know exactly how this ends. They sell off property and lease back for a short-term cash injection into the company, value goes up, investors cash out of a failing company to get what little they can. Suddenly all the financial backing is gone, parks struggle even more to operate successfully, then they’re inevitably evicted from their lease agreement because the land has more value as a shopping center or apartment complex.
As a diamond elite member I personally would hate to see the parks close. I paid my memberships ALL THROUGH THE PANDEMIC and didn’t get to use them once. But I remained a loyal member!!! And I’m sure I’m not the only one!! I hung in there and when it was all said and done we started going back. Didn’t get to go as much this year as I wanted due to personal reasons but have gotten a few trips in with my daughter. And we hopefully will be going many many times this year.
Same. I kept my diamond pass throughout but haven’t been as much. The coasters are more for thrill seeker obviously, so now being married, my wife doesn’t like those types and would rather go to Disney, so it’s harder to make the Six Flags days happen. And Disney is so ridiculously expensive.
Right now, the land has value as a theme park. That land is making a lot of money for the theme park.
After the land is sold, it has more value for commercial, residential, and industrial development than it does as a theme park. Six Flags will be forced out, and lose everything.
It will do nothing to improve the parks, and will add more pressure on the viability of the parks.
Sounds like a push by the “investors” to jeopardize the future of the parks for a short-term gain. Cashing out on the hard-asset, value-raising real estate, then paying rent on property you once owned and maintained seems like the worst possible “solution” for a temporary downturn in ticket sales.
The healthier decision would be to streamline operations, improve the product, and minimize unnecessary expenditures. The single most effective revenue boost may be to limit season pass sales, and slightly reduce regular ticket prices. By doing this, they would increase the number of PAYING daily visitors, and reduce park congestion (fewer non-paying season pass holders clogging the lines).
Sure, on the books season pass sales look like a big boost, but many season pass holders visit for just a few hours per visit and don’t eat in the park, so they only fill the park several times a year, without paying much more than a single-day ticket.
With fewer non-paying pass holders, the paying guests will enjoy their visit much more, and feel the visit was worth the price. Less congestion at a lower daily ticket price will almost guarantee repeat visits by paying customers… That will be more willing to purchase food while in the park. Conversely, selling more season passes, and increasing ticket prices will have the opposite effect.
Regarding season pass holders- if done right they will generate more money for you than short stay guests. They will be more likely to spend on items because they aren’t footing the entrance cost each time they come. And if you have add ons for faster ride admits, they will be more likely to pay for that, again because they didn’t pay to get in the gate.
Regarding season pass holders paying more for waiting in line. The more often a user is at the park the more likely they are able to find ways to take advantage of the park, such as ADA access and free food, spending as little money as possible which is what keeps them coming back. It is a value proposition. If it costs me nothing to go to the park, I’d rather come to the park than go other places that cost money. Charging one time fees for each visit keeps income coming in for the park and should be considered for all guests. However when the park intentionally shuts down rides that are expensive to run, and you come to the park for that ride, the visitor experience is poor and people don’t want to return.
We agree completely!! My husband and I were season pass holders at the Chicago park, but would be willing to return now, as single day ticket users, because what you are saying makes perfect sense.
A new CEO is needed, quality is being lost at Six Flags. Long time employees are being fired. Along with a new CEO, needs to be more partnerships, give Ways, and etc.
Wanting to sell your property then pay rent. Is a sell out. It is just the first step to close without the big wigs losing to much of their money. If they are doing this and firing long time employees. They will close the parks. This is nothing more than quiet filing bankruptcy.
Please I Beg that That Six Flags is not sold for the property value!! Magic MTN is the Only Place that allows me to Fell Happiness since everything that I Love has been Killed ❤️🙏
I would use kiosk sales in merch and food throughout the parks. Pay vetted and rides team members top dollar. Pay new employees MW and work up with quarterly increases. Increase the sales/marketing quota for group sales. Instead of purchasing new ride attractions each year, add more shows and childrens ET alternately.
All Six Flags needs to do is keep their parks clean..give the existing attractions some TLC and keep. In mind families, thrill seekers and children. Let’s face it….45 minute wait to ride the Tea Cups at Disneyland verse a walk on The Viper at Magic Mountain….all Six Flags needs to do is highlight and preserve the mastalgia of its parks. They can succeed.
Ok as someone who has been down this road with Six Flags before with Darien Lake, this is a wolf in sheep’s clothing. It’s just a means to an end to sell off your favorite park, close it because of some issue negotiating between said real estate company they sold it to (usually an issue they somehow seem to create themselves intentionally behind the scenes), and sell off the land to be redeveloped into something else, or to private owners who tend to really screw up the parks majorly and let them fall into extreme disrepair just like they did here in NY. We are lucky Six Flags came back, but the fact that the prior owners trashed the park and didn’t maintain it has left a permanent scar on us. Look at our Historic Giant Wheel for instance. You can’t. They let it fall into such a bad state that when Six Flags returned, they ended up having to close it and remove it because it was unsafe and the mechanisms blew apart. There was mold growing on the roofs of food shelters, holes in walls, all the paint was sunbleached into oblivion, every coaster was rough as can be, multiple rides were just SBNO, multiple rides stations and operator’s booths looked like they had been abandoned for years and were literally falling apart in pieces with missing panels, walls, etc. The paths were overgrown as can be and full of holes and tripping hazards, and abandoned attractions just sat there as a reminder of just how bad they screwed it up. What they need to do is stop focusing so much on thendarn water parks. Give us RIDES. Water Parks are nice and all. But we need RIDES! COASTERS! Retrack some of the most famous ones like Darien’s Viper, Ride of Steel, and the Predator (which im glad they did a section of, but realistically the whole darn thing needs it.).
Trust me when I say. Six Flags going down this route has trouble written all over it. Sounds good on the surface but in reality it may not be so great.
The place is being ran by kids! No respect or morals. Over worked and under paid. No overtime pay every! Expected to work under bad weather conditions, without the proper clothing too.
This would be a catastrophic long term plan. This trash activist investor only wants to make tons of profit right now at the cost of the company. He’d only sell his stock after the very short term large gains when they sell the land. Then he walks away with huge profits and six flags is left to wither and die as they now pay huge rents to be on land that they used to own
Selling the property killed Sears, killed Mervin’s. The only ones who won were the money people.
This is a losing proposition if you want to keep a company whose main product is NOT property, but owns and uses it, thriving. Property for them is an asset they are using.
Comments for Massive Theme Park Operator Instructed to Sell Properties
Ken
Look, Disneyland has been very successful. Not only they keep raising their prices, but the park is always packed to the max. If Magic Mountain could somehow partner up with Disney and bring some disney rides and their characters and their landscapes to Magic Mountain, without raising their prices to skyrocket, that could be a solution.
Suzanne Taylor
Southern California already has Disney parks and Disney characters!! We need to keep the Looney Tunes characters at Six Flags parks!!
Joe
I think they should terminate the new c e o
John Shumaker
Ken, you are a dork. Everyone knows that D land is for little kids and old ladies. The mountain is for getting the crap scared out of you. I’m not sure if you are on the right track but a really good hook could definitely help. I’m thinking that a monster coaster with a very lengthy ride time and features that only I can create to set records that will never be surpassed by any true coaster, ever.
Timothy
I dont think that is a good idea of selling of the land to a separate management company….some of the park could be off land as management company raises prices of leasing land and the park now closes and become housing developments or whearhouseing…and the smaller parks are most not owned by 6 flags and just ate management agreements
Rusty
No no no
Ron
Real estate lease backs are common practice in privately held companies. You create two companies, one holds the real estate and the other is the company itself. The “company” pays “rent” to the real estate holder, which is actually the same person or people. In this case they sell the real estate to a 3rd party to generate cash, and lease back from the new landowner. Not a bad way to raise cash as long as you get a long term lease that is unbreakable. Otherwise the new land owner can “evict” (tear down) the theme park and build condo’s or a shopping complex. Happens all the time in commercial real estate. Happy Holidays
Al
They need to get a new CEO! The guy is destroying Six Flags!
DB
Al: 100% agreed. This new CEO is BAD NEWS and needs to go…12 months ago!
Ron: You hit it – thr problem is Six Flags isn’t a private company and they aren’t doing it for asset and liability divestiture. Instead, as you pointed out, this would be going to some outside party (or likely many given the spread of properties) and I could see the theme parks ceasing to exist – one by one as they find people to buy the valuable rides for usage elsewhere (more capital for the “property investor”) then shut down the parks. If this happens, it will be the beginning of the end for Six Flags.
WisdomLost
Bad business!
Keeping real estate under a second holding company is just good business. But that’s not what is being suggested. These “investors” are looking for a payday, and are trying to force a very bad business decision on the park. Unless Six Flags is on the verge of going out of business, this does them no long-term benefit. It takes them from landowner to renter.
Bad business.
Mareline
I think making the park more fun for younger kids, revamping Bugs Bunny world would help attract new customers.
Keeping Roaring Rapids open through the fall would help retain locals. They only have one water ride open in the park year round, it’s super hot out here..
They’ve done away with a lot of features that made the park great. The most memorable attraction was Tidal Wave, that’s gone now. I think getting rid of log jammers was also a bad move. They replaced it with a theatre that’s never used.
More advertising would help. Magic mountain was so cool when I was a kid, and I remember seeing commercials about it.
My teen loves to go to six flags now with his friends and they spend money, we make sure they have money to spend. I resented the comment about not focusing on broke teens, teens are what keep the park going.
A new family ride is probably the best solution. If they want to attract higher income families they need a new family ride and maybe a top notch day care service, something like kids quest but with a six flags flare they can put it in the old log jammer location, near the restaurant and Bugs bunny world would be the perfect location.
Shawn
Selling off assets is what killed sears. Having to be Holden to share holders will always cause businesses to fail. Doing this is going to be the first step to the end of Six flags. I’m sure these “investors”. Just want to make as much money in the short term as they can just like those who made the choices for sears. They will first sell the properties an lease them. Then the leases will go up. When six flags can’t cover them they sell seize ownership. Sell the assets (coasters) the. The land to developers. The end of the business. In the end the ones owning the land will make all the money. Don’t do it.
Icat512
I’m a Disney person myself, however I do enjoy going to Six Flags. It is different. I will say this, if Six Flags gives up their real estate, it will not end well. The investors are in it for the money, and if they can make money by selling the land or building huge Resorts or communities, that’s where they are ultimately going to go. They will eat Six Flags alive. Don’t do it.
Dr. Commonsense
This is exactly what someone would push for if they want to dump their shareholdings. We know exactly how this ends. They sell off property and lease back for a short-term cash injection into the company, value goes up, investors cash out of a failing company to get what little they can. Suddenly all the financial backing is gone, parks struggle even more to operate successfully, then they’re inevitably evicted from their lease agreement because the land has more value as a shopping center or apartment complex.
Stephanie
As a diamond elite member I personally would hate to see the parks close. I paid my memberships ALL THROUGH THE PANDEMIC and didn’t get to use them once. But I remained a loyal member!!! And I’m sure I’m not the only one!! I hung in there and when it was all said and done we started going back. Didn’t get to go as much this year as I wanted due to personal reasons but have gotten a few trips in with my daughter. And we hopefully will be going many many times this year.
Dapos
Same. I kept my diamond pass throughout but haven’t been as much. The coasters are more for thrill seeker obviously, so now being married, my wife doesn’t like those types and would rather go to Disney, so it’s harder to make the Six Flags days happen. And Disney is so ridiculously expensive.
Marty
The land has the value for commercial, residential and industrial development.
WisdomLost
Right now, the land has value as a theme park. That land is making a lot of money for the theme park.
After the land is sold, it has more value for commercial, residential, and industrial development than it does as a theme park. Six Flags will be forced out, and lose everything.
It will do nothing to improve the parks, and will add more pressure on the viability of the parks.
This can only harm Six Flags in the long run.
WisdomLost
Sounds like a push by the “investors” to jeopardize the future of the parks for a short-term gain. Cashing out on the hard-asset, value-raising real estate, then paying rent on property you once owned and maintained seems like the worst possible “solution” for a temporary downturn in ticket sales.
The healthier decision would be to streamline operations, improve the product, and minimize unnecessary expenditures. The single most effective revenue boost may be to limit season pass sales, and slightly reduce regular ticket prices. By doing this, they would increase the number of PAYING daily visitors, and reduce park congestion (fewer non-paying season pass holders clogging the lines).
Sure, on the books season pass sales look like a big boost, but many season pass holders visit for just a few hours per visit and don’t eat in the park, so they only fill the park several times a year, without paying much more than a single-day ticket.
With fewer non-paying pass holders, the paying guests will enjoy their visit much more, and feel the visit was worth the price. Less congestion at a lower daily ticket price will almost guarantee repeat visits by paying customers… That will be more willing to purchase food while in the park. Conversely, selling more season passes, and increasing ticket prices will have the opposite effect.
No FreeParking
Regarding season pass holders- if done right they will generate more money for you than short stay guests. They will be more likely to spend on items because they aren’t footing the entrance cost each time they come. And if you have add ons for faster ride admits, they will be more likely to pay for that, again because they didn’t pay to get in the gate.
Freeparking
Regarding season pass holders paying more for waiting in line. The more often a user is at the park the more likely they are able to find ways to take advantage of the park, such as ADA access and free food, spending as little money as possible which is what keeps them coming back. It is a value proposition. If it costs me nothing to go to the park, I’d rather come to the park than go other places that cost money. Charging one time fees for each visit keeps income coming in for the park and should be considered for all guests. However when the park intentionally shuts down rides that are expensive to run, and you come to the park for that ride, the visitor experience is poor and people don’t want to return.
Suzanne Taylor
We agree completely!! My husband and I were season pass holders at the Chicago park, but would be willing to return now, as single day ticket users, because what you are saying makes perfect sense.
Steve
Hostess had a bad CEO and sold company.
NEXTEL had bad CEO and sold company.
A new CEO is needed, quality is being lost at Six Flags. Long time employees are being fired. Along with a new CEO, needs to be more partnerships, give Ways, and etc.
Roxanne
Wanting to sell your property then pay rent. Is a sell out. It is just the first step to close without the big wigs losing to much of their money. If they are doing this and firing long time employees. They will close the parks. This is nothing more than quiet filing bankruptcy.
Vanessa
Please I Beg that That Six Flags is not sold for the property value!! Magic MTN is the Only Place that allows me to Fell Happiness since everything that I Love has been Killed ❤️🙏
Suzanne Taylor
SAVE Six Flags Magic Mountain and Six Flags Great America!!
J
These billionaire profiteers are all that is wrong with this world they need to be shut down before they buy up and destroy everything good!!!
Marie Dixon
I would use kiosk sales in merch and food throughout the parks. Pay vetted and rides team members top dollar. Pay new employees MW and work up with quarterly increases. Increase the sales/marketing quota for group sales. Instead of purchasing new ride attractions each year, add more shows and childrens ET alternately.
Andrew
All Six Flags needs to do is keep their parks clean..give the existing attractions some TLC and keep. In mind families, thrill seekers and children. Let’s face it….45 minute wait to ride the Tea Cups at Disneyland verse a walk on The Viper at Magic Mountain….all Six Flags needs to do is highlight and preserve the mastalgia of its parks. They can succeed.
Ibuddy66
Ok as someone who has been down this road with Six Flags before with Darien Lake, this is a wolf in sheep’s clothing. It’s just a means to an end to sell off your favorite park, close it because of some issue negotiating between said real estate company they sold it to (usually an issue they somehow seem to create themselves intentionally behind the scenes), and sell off the land to be redeveloped into something else, or to private owners who tend to really screw up the parks majorly and let them fall into extreme disrepair just like they did here in NY. We are lucky Six Flags came back, but the fact that the prior owners trashed the park and didn’t maintain it has left a permanent scar on us. Look at our Historic Giant Wheel for instance. You can’t. They let it fall into such a bad state that when Six Flags returned, they ended up having to close it and remove it because it was unsafe and the mechanisms blew apart. There was mold growing on the roofs of food shelters, holes in walls, all the paint was sunbleached into oblivion, every coaster was rough as can be, multiple rides were just SBNO, multiple rides stations and operator’s booths looked like they had been abandoned for years and were literally falling apart in pieces with missing panels, walls, etc. The paths were overgrown as can be and full of holes and tripping hazards, and abandoned attractions just sat there as a reminder of just how bad they screwed it up. What they need to do is stop focusing so much on thendarn water parks. Give us RIDES. Water Parks are nice and all. But we need RIDES! COASTERS! Retrack some of the most famous ones like Darien’s Viper, Ride of Steel, and the Predator (which im glad they did a section of, but realistically the whole darn thing needs it.).
Trust me when I say. Six Flags going down this route has trouble written all over it. Sounds good on the surface but in reality it may not be so great.
Chris
This is bad news. Nothing good can come from this for anyone who cares about Six Flags. Sounds like some Gordon Gekko crap.
Hello
The place is being ran by kids! No respect or morals. Over worked and under paid. No overtime pay every! Expected to work under bad weather conditions, without the proper clothing too.
Sean
This would be a catastrophic long term plan. This trash activist investor only wants to make tons of profit right now at the cost of the company. He’d only sell his stock after the very short term large gains when they sell the land. Then he walks away with huge profits and six flags is left to wither and die as they now pay huge rents to be on land that they used to own
Christian
Heard Paramount buying it most likely. Will be great for them to have it as others ares able to use their theme parks as tax incentives.
Lisa Harrigan
Selling the property killed Sears, killed Mervin’s. The only ones who won were the money people.
This is a losing proposition if you want to keep a company whose main product is NOT property, but owns and uses it, thriving. Property for them is an asset they are using.
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