Credit: New Line Cinema
This article has alt right racism written all over it. Were you upset that an Americans played many beloved characters in LOTR… oh so it’s just the pigment of one’s skin.
That’s what you got out of it?? Their talking about keeping the story as true as possible. With the backgrounds and inspiration of Northern Europe. And you think that’s alt-right? You couldn’t be more of a fake, obtuse, woke mouth breather.
There are legitimate points to be made about Tolkein’s anti-corp views in regards to his intellectual property, you should have focused on that historically accurate issue rather than publishing part of a racist rant against the existence of POC in a Tolkein adaptation.
I completely agree with Lee. That article is dripping will vile alt-right racism. It’s not an historical re-telling to re-enactment, it’s fantasy, so we don’t need to apply ridiculous arbitrary rules to who qualifies to play a role. Furthermore, you have no real idea what Tolkien thought, or how he would react to the situation as it is now(in this day and age). Black and Asian people are present and naturalised in both Europe and America, and it’s about time that you and others like you, accept and embrace it. Alternatively, you can just crawl back into your incel wankpit and shut the f*** up. Moron.
Yes Asian, blacks and other races are naturalized in Europe today, but the story is not done “in today”. I for one don’t care about the nationality of the actor as long as they are good in the role. However the people that do speak of origins of the story are correct. The only problem are the people that refuse to except it. If they want a diverse fantasy then I suggest they write one. Changing an author’s work to fit into “today” is just wrong. If you don’t like how the author portrays his characters then don’t read the story/watch the movie.
We DO know how Tolkien though. If you didn’t know, he actually put his thoughts on paper, quite extensively. There were not black dwarves in his universe. Perhaps Tolkien was a bit of a racist and his world should be updated for modern adaptstions
Throw your masks back on, booster up, grab some bubble wrap and crawl back into your happy space. If all you can see is inherent racism in week read fans that would like to see Tolkien’s work portrait as written then you are truly a lost cause. Triggered much?
Hell, I have no problem watching Asian, Hispanic, Negro ( yes Negro, not all black people are African American ) or any other race or cultures film o literary works not including caucasian characters. Damn, grow up and get over this ridiculousness. Go back to protecting spotted owls and snail darters and leave other folks 5he hell alone.
You said it!!!
Only an idiot would accuse woke b.s. as “alt right”.
this is a surprisingly unbiased article, and if you can’t separate your ass backward politics from a fantasy already penned and cherished in the hearts of millions of fans at least have the humility to shut up and let people have their own opinions. Tolkien hated politics and took great pains to avoid a political message in his stories, adding one in is an insult to his legacy and fundamentally against everything the stories were about.
I dunno. It was the reddit post “he created the most beautiful language (elvish) based off of” European/white languages that had me going, “well this seems biased”, and since the article elevates that post, it makes the article seem biased.
I know it’s really hard to believe, but the Europeans who gave rise to all the myths and languages he fell in love with weren’t all white. Europe has never been all white. And claiming a fantasy series like this has to stick incorrect racial expectations is….ignorant at best, and racist at worst. Let’s stop rewriting European history and erasing darker skin tones in the process.
Nope Europe has been PRODOMINANTLY WHITE. PULL YOUR HEAD OUR YUR ASS
Sorry, but you have added the racial aspect by including “white” to the description of the language. Just because you or others call something racist, does not make it so. Criticism of the fundamental changes to an epic story for the sake of today’s obsession of some of wokeness, inclusion, and diversity is not racist. As someone else said, if you want an inclusive and woke story, then come up with something original instead of destroying a classic that has entertained generations.
The Ottoman empire called, they said to read a book
I agree. They read a story and say, oh I loved it except I would change this and add that. Lol…I would like to see them write their own novel and have other people come along to “make changes to fit to today” . No author likes having their stories changed just to suit people that want to change it. It’s why some authors won’t allow their work to go to the big screen.
So Tolkien specifically said all the races were white ? Everyone on both sides go too far . Too much wokeness vs the angry white conservatives.
Elves, yes. They are very specifically white. PALE white. And Dwarves live underground…
Thanks for that. The good professor. Made all of that perfectly clear to any that actually took the effort to read his amazing words. Sadly, most people’s experience with Professor Tolkien’s works, now days, is the cinema and television. One must actually read to get a more complete understanding.
Because clueless one, THERE ARE NO AFRICANS IN EUROPEAN MYTHS YOU DUNCE. AND I SUPPOSE YOU WOULDN’T MIND A WHITE GUY PLAYING CHAKA ZULU ??????????? HYPOCRITE
Africans now live and have even been born in Northern Europe. Why shouldn’t they play characters in the world of Middle Earth? At any point in his books does J.R.R.Tolkien write ‘this person was white’ or ‘they had pale skin’?
In fact, yes He did.
Dark skinned people did not make their way to Europe until long after the vikings had their peak. Tolkien wrote this influenced by an Era far before that. No. There are no black or dark skinned people in the Silmarillion. People need to get over that and stop injecting diversity where it isn’t needed.
so what color were the harad? were they not black? and what european myth did the elephant-like oliphaunts come from then?
Come on, cheddar man was dark skinned, and he was long before the vikings. And while yeah, most vikings did not have dark skin, there were a number that did, because people moved around.
I get the love for Tolkein, I do. But this idea that he was some amazing world builder is flawed. Yes, in depth story, yes complicated and rich history, but in a world with so many races, he made almost everyone white and male and fans should at least be willing to admit how that falls short. If you can’t critically read the stories that you claim to love, you don’t really value them.
When you grow up in a world where widespread travel is still fairly a novelty, you’d probably tend to imagine the people in the stories you tell to mostly look like the people surrounding you too. It doesn’t mean your world building is flawed, it just means your world building is influenced by the huge world in which you live which is really just a small pocket in an even larger world. It’s actually super exciting how big the world can be that everything we know about the world around us can seem so big, yet that is only a small picture of an even bigger story.
so what european myth did the giant, elephant-like oliphaunts come from?
There were wooly mammoth s in Europe and North America.
so you’re saying tolkien combined african culture/history (aka the harad) who rode on these supposedly european based wooly mammoths? that doesnt sound very accurate to european history to me! /s
Wrong. There is actually a black knight in the earliest King Arthur stories. Sir Morien was a knight of Moorish decent at Arthur’s round table.
The comment in the article said it best- Middle Earth is based on the culture, history, and people of Europe. I know that’s not exactly trendy these days, but that’s the world Tolkien created and its the one beloved by so many. I don’t suppose people would accept a Black Panther movie full of white Wakandans, would they?
so what part of european culture/history/people are the elephant-looking oliphaunts and their riders based on?
The point that “woke” perspectives can’t explain (or insult) away is the overriding tendency of today’s media wanting to insert change -cultural, racial, sexual, Eric. – simply for change’s sake. If you took a “black and Asian” historical fantasy story, created by bygone generations, and inserted “white” (aka northern European) elements – simply as a means to make the story more appealing to that culture and audience – which sadly has happened in the past too – that would be equally wrong. It’s simply applying the same action in a reverse scenario and asking yourself if those actions are still appropriate? Not a hard hypothetical exercise the many today should practice. So yes, this actually is a historical retelling, not missing your point that Tolkien’s stories aren’t ‘actual’ history but are now a part of our modern cultural history. There’s nothing wrong with sticking to the original material, and those who throw strong teens like “alt right” and “racist” are simply furthering the watering down of those terms.
Elephants lived in erouope along side humans for hundreds of thousands years, Google it bub
You know white people exist in Black Panther, right? They just come the vast areas outside the tiny, secretive land of Wakanda.
Exactly. In ancient world settings, the world was so expansive that different populations tended to be fairly isolated from one another. It’s only when we began to develop technology that the world began to shrink and different populations began to merge. Black Panther takes place in a modern world where different groups have the ability to interact with one another fairly easily. But even then, like 90% of the main cast in Black Panther is black. And it’s perfect that way. Because it gives the sense of culture managing to stand on its own in a wider world.
Found the racist
Alt right racism? Are you intentionally being a knob? The author/casting and stated central theme of these stories is anglo-centric. So yes there is some concern when a “new” version is created completely spiting the author and stated purpose for these stories existence. Naturally, if one is speaking of ancient myths in the western European/Anglo-Saxon sphere of influence; There isn’t much deviation in skin pigment, not because it’s racist but because geographically it’s correct, and the break of that suspension of disbelief to support “the message” ruins the central narrative. Stop being a bell-end and injecting racism where you want it to exist.
Haven’t read the article yet, just the comments, so I’ll just weigh in on an observation that the sentiment of the author is that we should respect the world at the time of the author and keep it as intended. Which is why no people of color should ever do a Shakespearean play other than Othello. Did I get that right? No reinterpretation or reimagination if any literary device ever?
100%. and that long-winded quote by “LOTR fans SUS” whining about european history is literally just saying “its bad because there’s black people in it”.
Exactly my take too. Alt-right racism is rife in this article.
If black skinned characters were written in the stories Tolkien wrote, but they werent. This would be the very same thing if Disney got a new boss and told marvel that they want to change the entire Legend of the black panther, by add white characters to be more inclusive.. You’d be throwing a temper tantrum. Is it a crime to make a serise based on how the story was actually written without changing it up for diversity sake.
So no Shakespearean plays ever performed by anyone other that white men?
um yes they were. the harad were clearly black. its quite obvious none of you actually care about ‘accurate european history’ and are more concerned about trying to be subtly racist.
Ummm have you read the books??? Not everyone was white.
Typical racist comment..shame on yourself for being so single minded. This is about HISTORY and Tolkien’s LEGACY. You can’t rewrite HISTORY as much as you want to.. The LEGACY is for the Man that created this wonderful world of Middle Earth..not the showrunners and screenwriters that want it to be theirs.
Thats gaslighting bro. You ignored all his constructive points and just cried “racist”!
The people who cry rAcIst or aLT RiGht, would probably be the subject for a retelling of “the boy who cried wolf”
Mmmm …. there’s s something wrong with you. You obviously come into the conversation with a bias and chip on your shoulder. You see demons where there are none. The article is objective.
I actually think most fans are reasonable and don’t like the fact that Amazon has changed characters to be different from the books, fundamentally changing them. I believe Tolkien wrote of a part of middle earth where black people did live. Why not bring those people into the show, instead of changing dwarves and elves etc. That would make more sense. Create something new, don’t tear down the old. You can keep the old and add the new.
There is nothing vile, racist, or alt-right by preserving the artistic integrity of a franchise. This attempt to smear any criticism by slandering it with such politically loaded terms is a disgraceful and cowardly thing.
Yes. Lord of the rings should be White. Go make your own garbage.
Lol liberals are the biggest racists. They literally think they’re better than blacks bc they’re white. They think blacks are too stupid and poor to have a ID. Lol
I completely agree! This article is disturbing. I’m a massive Tolkien fan and they are way out of line.
If you see racism in this article than I am not sure how you even go out your door every day.
I won’t be watching it, instead think I will dust off my D&D books and grab my dice instead.
They clearly wanted the cheapest actors. Shame because the Shire used to be crime free but now has Noggits.
They say it’s necessary to strengthen the economy due to the Shire’s dwindling birth rates.
The problem with these ppl is that they can’t just invent a new fantasy. They must take a brilliant work from someone dead and trash it without ever asking permission. Make your own woke work and leave tradition in peace.
Where is her beard! AHHHHHH! That Dwarf woman looks female! This is an offense! A major offense to dwarves! Dwarves are supposed to be indistinguishable! This is unholy!
Uhhhh. This whole article is incorrect. They already have TV adaptation rights for the Hobbit. But they know a remake will flop because it’s too soon to remake the Hobbit after PJ’s films, so they’re going for Second Age era instead. What this tweet is talking about is the acquisition of the PJ Hobbit film distribution rights via the purchase of MGM.
There are reasons other than economic ones to hire lesser-known actors. Remember “Game of Thrones”?
Remember how that ended once the writers ran out of source material and used there own “creative” minds
Stop making this about race. A black dwarf princess isn’t the problem, it’s a symptom of the true disease…MONEY! Non-whites are being used to expand the viewing base. It’s a damn shame that money corrupts everything eventually. I don’t blame actors of color for wanting to be a part of an epic project. I blame producers who aren’t artist but rather bankers.
I 100% agree with this comment
But it is about race? Forced diversity is a massive problem. People viewing other people as people and not based on skin color is being pushed away by all of this. Has anyone even asked how it’s biologically possible for a black dwarf to even exist? Where did the melanin come from in a mountain?
can you explain how its biologically possible that elves can live forever? lol shut up.
It’s in the books. It’s so clearly obvious you haven’t read any of them, yet you keep asking childish questions. Why?
Totally agree with this comment
No. No no no no no no no. Did I mention no? Nononono. Stop it. No.
I thought Peter Jackson did a great job on lord of the rings. But the Hobbit is a children’s book. It needs to be remade as such. Given the market and popularity of children’s movies this makes perfect sense.
I am looking forward to this series. If it’s well directed and cast with talented, worthy actors, why not? Most well-known actors began as unknown…
i’ll check it out because i’m not a moron racist pretending like i care about the authenticity of “european history” while watching a show about thousand year old elves, walking trees and magical rings.
reading some of these comments of dork loser racists is hilariously embarrassing.
You’re probably too dense to understand what the adults are talking about…
Actually you moron of you read any of the ligit source material on multiple accounts he does in fact reference pale or fair skin 😮💨🥱 read before you speak
Considering what they did to The Wheel of Time, my hopes aren’t high for them handling Tolkien’s work
Kill Your Television! Remove the government and corporate propaganda from your mind. I have constructed a special hat that blocks all that out. It also quiets the nanobots I received in my booster..
Ryan Renolds would be perfect for a Tupac biopic. Just heckin saying.
Since The Hobbit movie(s) turned into a cash grab spanning 3 films, and it was written as they went, maybe a different version is needed to give it the attention it’s due.
The Hobbit was trash. They couldn’t even stick with the book. Not even close…and way too many times.
Stick to reading and avoid this garage.
So you’re mad that somebody wants to protect one of the greatest works of fiction. From people who can’t even write an original story and want to use a pre-existing fantasy world, since it has a name that near everybody in the world knows about and a fan base that loves and cherishes it. Token is no longer alive to defend his beloved franchise and now a corporation is raping his beloved franchise. This has to deal with one thing: the fact that Amazon bought the rights to the Hobbit. To bring up racism argument angle shows that you have no way to argue against those besides yelling racism and alt right. God is dead and we killed them.
Yeah amazon will probably wokify all this stuff. But i might be an ok series. Eh give it a chance.
Real simple boy and girls. Respect Tolkien. Don’t watch. Dont Join. Avoid And talk about the trash big business is doing to private individuals and their works. It’s real simple.
Your an idiot if you think that!!!
Dear God what’s next?? Black men playing George Washington?!?!? Heaven forbid! *Feigns Cult45 faint*
To everyone here claiming alt-right racism: does the sound of a race-swapped reboot of Roots sit well with you? If it doesn’t sit well with you then you are a racist. Maybe alt-left racist. Speaking out against such a thing would be tantamount to using alt-left racist dog whistles.
Alt left doesn’t exist, you just made it up.
And the alt-right boogeyman does?
There is so much money involved with this project that in order to bring out this “woke”and “besmerched”adaptation that you have to throw in shills to make false claims that fans of Tolkiens life’s work and Tolkien himself must now be racist.
Making These shills the actual racists;and furthermore Amazon fueling the flames with these Shills blind with hopes of the revenue and re-writing Tolkiens works because for all of Besos money and richness still cannot afford the rights to all of Tolkiens work and now true fans are being considered racist by racist shills who are simply shills.
lol what? you seem like you haven’t read a book in your life.
Here’s the thing, had Disney left the Star Wars universe alone, we never would have got the Mandalorian which imo is gold. Yes there have been a few misses along the way with some of the movies, but it is all just entertainment. If you don’t like the movie or TV show, you chalk it up as bad and move on. Meanwhile there will always be someone who enjoys it and brings them some happiness in their life (which we all need more of).
The purity and innocence of Tolkien’s works are what make reading and yes watching the film’s so wonderful.
Every vice good or bad is represented in the Hobbit and the lord of the rings, except sex and religion and that’s the way it should be kept
lol the purity? are you stupid? the tolkien estate didnt even like peter jacksons films. by that logic, none of those movies should be celebrated either.
If all this is about race I have no comment. My only concern is that Amazon does not destroy Toilken’s beautiful work. Stick to his version not one u make up
Well after Disney ran Star Wars in to the ground I’m sure many were looking for Amazon to do the same to Lord of the Rings…
Now if Google could acquire the rights to…?
Oh!!! No– the Bible!
I really don’t like Bezos or Amazon. I really wish a different company had aquired these rights. Too bad it’s run by a garbage human being.
I’m laughing that people had any faith in any adaptation done by Amazon. After the dumpster fire of Wheel of time this past winter and the deep disrespect they showed to Robert Jordan and his amazing book series(book one had many homages to LoTR and Jordan has been cited saying Tolkien inspired him greatly) I knew they would make this series just as broken. I don’t give two licks about skin color, disrespecting the source material is what gets me. Tolkien was a masterful writer and his love for his creation shows in every iota of his books, thinking you can do it ‘better’ than he did will net you nothing but backlash from fans who truly love the material whether they are of African descent, caucasian, Asian, Latino or whatever. Race isn’t the issue, respect is.
Yeah if they could only do the whole thing word for word . Tolkien is not a god he was very close minded in a ton of areas . The dwarves in Snow White made him nauseous? Dude it’s for kids . Nobody has ever adapted a book to a movie and made the book readers happy ever . And it might not be about race to you but thousands of a holes in these forums won’t shut up about it . Probably the same ppl who never even paid for any of the content
Omg there’s gonna be colored ppl in a made up fantasy about dragons and elves and dwarves. No thanks I’ll go watch the jetsons , that’s the only fantasy I like all white
Amazon does not own the rights to lord of the rings still under warner brothers
I hate film adaptations of my favorite books, the only thing studios care about is making money. I won’t be watching this, I’ll be reading the books instead. Amazon can go screw themselves.
Another epic bites the dust.
I am so f*cking sick of the purposeful destruction of my country, culture & history.
I don’t understand why people have to assert their own modern Political, Cultural and personal viewpoints into Tolkien’s life’s work. Is respecting his ancestry, lineage and vision for his own masterpiece to much to ask? There are two words that come to mind
It’s reeeeeeaaaaally simple: if you have a problem with a person of color playing a character in a fantasy world filled with trolls, goblins, dragons, giant spiders, etc….. Then your racist. Period. Nothing you say changes that simple fact.
I had a problem with a white guy playing Thanos’ brother in Eternals without Photoshop.
I looked online, and apparently he was adopted. Makes sense, though not necessarily preferable.
Ikaris kind of bothered me too, he looked too modern to exist in such ancient settings as portrayed in the movie.
Point is, if the appearance of the character doesn’t make sense, I have a problem with it regardless of whether they’re a person of color or white.
I’m assuming “your country” is England….. Which is one of the most racially mixed countries on the planet………
Probably depends on the time period. In the modern world, absolutely. But Middle Earth does not take place in a Modern Type setting.
Amazon shouldn’t do anything to do with Tolkien’s works, unless they just legitimately enjoy burning money. They’ve proven to be creatively bankrupt hacks who have no interest in honoring the source material. They just want another opportunity to push “The Message” and their politics onto audiences under a brand name they know will attract attention. We see it time and time again with these franchises. Rings of Power will crash and burn just like Disney Star Wars, Star Trek, Marvel and DC comics, the list goes on and on.
I heard that the Hispanic actor playing the Elf was going to be playing a Silvan Elf. Correct me if I’m wrong, but aren’t Silvan Elves like a family line. Their argument is that they are reflecting the real world with different races living together and stuff like that, which I guess I can understand in some since, but last time I checked, tightly bound family lines don’t just randomly change ethnic groups between generations. (Intermarriage is possible, but we’ve never seen any indication of it on such a large scale in Middle Earth before.)
This story needs some serious verification. As far as I can tell, the only rights that Amazon has gained recently were the distribution rights for ‘The Hobbit’ that were previously held by MGM. I see no confirmation anywhere that Amazon has acquired all non-book rights to ‘The Hobbit’ that were purchased by The Saul Zaentz Company. Very sloppy reporting!
Everything I don’t like is alt-right.
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